Tarmac Rally Stratos Build begins

[ByrneEngineering]

Hi guys, so I've finally got started on our startos tarmac rally car preparations, I'll try to keep the videos coming

https://youtu.be/lIim0vgXGFs

[LPH_UK]

'Safety beer' :D I like your style.

Great that you are doing these videos, cheers!

[westonTB]

Safety Beer! Excellent, I have safety Roger Perry style red wine... may explain why I am behind schedule:o Keep up the good work & Cheers!

[ByrneEngineering]

Oh yes, those safety beers are vital;)

Next instalment of engine installation, enjoy!

https://youtu.be/AGsThq-MAeI

[westonTB]

Colin, these videos are excellent and good learning where ever any of us are with our builds. Really looking forward to see how your Hawk gets on, if it is anything like your 105 it will be awesome, the project Binky of the Stratos world!

Unless I'm missing something I can't think of anyone else doing a youtube build on a Stratos to this level, (or at all) Inspiration indeed!

Cheers.

[Stratos Fear]

Well done Colin - an interesting video ! Keep up the good work!

Peter C

[ByrneEngineering]

Thanks for the comments guys!, will definitely try and keep up the videos, just uploaded episode 2

https://youtu.be/N8-jtGLO4Uk

[Strat Fan]

Hello Colin,
Irrespective of the new reg changes just thrown into the mix can I ask why choose side draughts rather than down draughts?
One of the biggest pains with the stock Alfa motor is getting access to the plugs and coil packs under the rear mounted plenum chamber. Switching to central ITB's eliminates this problem and gives great access to both banks of plugs/coils.
The forward mounted carbs/bodies would allow great access to the rear bank but severely limit access to the front bank instead.
Regards

[ByrneEngineering]

Main Reason for side droughts was the simple fact that I've got some here and got a lot of jets etc (and experience) from the 105, also liked the idea of the longer runners. Agree that access to the plugs would be an issue, however with just a set of throttle bodies, rather than a complete carbie, it may be possible to just remove the airbox to gain plug/coil access. having said that, just pulling the Throttle bodies off would be nothing compared to having to ensure each inlet valve is closed before removing/installing the plug (and then properly indexing it) like we have to do on the 2L!

[ByrneEngineering]

Still up the front of the car, got a couple more bits and pieces sorted, starting to run out of space already!

https://youtu.be/-8PP0RFCtAU

[ByrneEngineering]

Roll Cage installation begins
https://youtu.be/1B_-8GcRU8g

[ByrneEngineering]

Roll Cage installation continues!

https://youtu.be/NDLYuMADmnE

[ByrneEngineering]

Roll Cage Done!
https://youtu.be/I729_-ItBeA

[LPH_UK]

Nice work. Looks very sturdy!

[ByrneEngineering]

thanks, yea chunky little cage, all the bars are very short which is great for stiffness and weight, the rules dictate a very substantial cage for tarmac rallying so every bar I added was mandatory with the exception of the small brace bar between the two vertical windscreen pillars and the front leg that connects to the chassis.


I though a 105 alfa coupe was a tight fit for a cage!, but this was a real challenge, particularly with the fiberglass vs welding factor

[LPH_UK]

Yep it certainly looked like a tricky job, you were welding in some very tight spaces there!

[ByrneEngineering]

nothing worse than welding upside down....nothing

[LPH_UK]

Yes there is. My welding. It's worse than anything you've ever seen.......I can't do it to save my life!

[Normb666]

Leigh, for a moment there I read that as your WEDDING. And worse than anything we've ever seen.... ooo, best keep this away from Herself, methinks... :)

[LPH_UK]

Norm, I've been with the other half for just over 24 years and we've still not got married. More chance of me learning to weld than getting hitched!

[Normb666]

Suppose that must also mean you won't be fitting a tow bar to the LB then! (phew!)

[ByrneEngineering]

So with the roll cage done for now, time to move on to mounting some seats

https://youtu.be/qo1bso8HrzQ (https://youtu.be/qo1bso8HrzQ)

[LOFT6.6]

Colin, loving the vids and the progress you are making. Just a lack of "Safety Beer" in your seat episode - never take your eye off the all important H&S mate! :rolleyes:

[ByrneEngineering]

Thanks mate, don't worry, plenty of HSE meetings behind the scenes, i'll make sure to include them in future!

[ByrneEngineering]

So with the seats in i moved to adding some pedals

https://youtu.be/aZuIpqnWjvk

[ByrneEngineering]

Hi guys, been a bit of a break since my last update, i headed over to Sweden for my annual work trip was over there for 3 weeks doing some
snow and ice vehicle testing (always good rally practice!) anyway managed to sneak back into he country before everything got to crazy and with some
time in the workshop have moved onto the new rear uprights. They are very much based on the hawk ones but have a bigger 82mm bearing to suit the
Peugeot hubs i'm planning on running (The PCD suits my existing wheels and have a bigger spline), I think the original Alfa GTA hubs also use an 82mm outer bearing also??
Next I'll move onto the new rear suspension arms and have made some good progress with the steering column.


https://youtu.be/NNoDYC5KLGw

[LOFT6.6]

Colin,
Nice work mate and perfect timing with the safety beers!

[ByrneEngineering]

https://youtu.be/Iyh9TjUlL-o

Bit of rear suspension action

[LPH_UK]

Amazing work! I wish I had these skills. Keep posting the videos please, really enjoy them.

[ByrneEngineering]

Next video, gearbox linkage, very happy with the result, no additional linkages required from the standard Alfa setup!


https://youtu.be/jiwj1x3K-hM

[ProtoTipo]

I did something similar in January 2009.
Move the selector on the splines round by drilling a new hole.
I turned the original Alfa selector casting/housing round, but a new one (like you've made) with mounting holes to line up would have been neat.
I used a Mk2 MR2 stick.

[Stratos Fear]

Interesting video Colin - I envy your lathe and machining skills - wish I had them!

Small point - I was turned up to max volume for your machining sequences - could I suggest you wear a microphone when not talking directly to camera ? Just a thought - but otherwise a great piece of work !



Next video, gearbox linkage, very happy with the result, no additional linkages required from the standard Alfa setup!


https://youtu.be/jiwj1x3K-hM

[ByrneEngineering]

My road to machining skills "or lack of" has been paved in broken carbide endmills and oversized/undersized parts trust me!

Yea i know the sound is crap, i've bought a couple of cheap mic's but didn't help much. I've finally bitten the bullet and dropped some serious cash on a proper Rode wireless mic, hopefully that fixes it! should be here next week


I did something similar in January 2009.

Nice, yea didn't think i'd be the first


I used a Mk2 MR2 stick.

I looked at these early on, but not many around so people asking a lot for them, anyway the alfa one seems to work OK and has the advantage of keeping the reverse gate

[john]

Are the standard Alfa cables long enough?

[ProtoTipo]

I looked at these early on, but not many around so people asking a lot for them, anyway the alfa one seems to work OK and has the advantage of keeping the reverse gate

The reverse gate lock out was a worry with the MR2 stick.
The advantage was that it was all steel, so I could modify it if needed.

John,
In my case, the cables needed extra bits at the stick end, but I used these to adapt to the MR2 cable ends for the MR2 stick.
It's all on Chris Savage's old Corse now.

[LOFT6.6]

Colin, loving following your series of Vids, just a bit different from the New Builds. Glad you are keeping H&S matters in hand with the odd Safety Beer, or two.
Cheers!
Ade

[ChrisCar6]

What steering rack are you using?

[ByrneEngineering]

john, The standard cables are about 300mm too short for me, in the process of getting some new ones made up now

thanks Ade, safety first!

Going to stick with the triumph/spitfire rack, the one in the car is absolutely stuffed, from what I've read, sounds like a quick rack is the go? bit pricey but worth it?

[ChrisCar6]

The 2.5 turn Triumph rack from Rimmer is perfect, but the manufacturer says not for motorsport use, which makes me uncomfortable, but I haven't found anything other than a custom built alternative.

[ByrneEngineering]

Interesting, what failure are they worried about? is it the casting or the actually rack/pinion? as you say not a whole lot of options for a front mount rack, and I've already built the column based around that rack, Has anyway had the standard ones fail?

[ChrisCar6]

Don't know what the exact concern is - maybe back-covering? Here's the letter they sent out to all who had bought one.

[ByrneEngineering]

Thanks for the info Chris, I sent them an email about it and got this response.

we don't have common failures of the steering rack, we just don't want to 'guarantee' the stresses of some motorsports are suitable for these racks, sorry.

Sounds like ass covering to me!

[colin artus]

What about using GP4 twin shear type steering arms rather than a high ratio rack? I see a number of advantages; adjustability of ratio range, use of female rod ends in place of MGB tre and further scope for adjusting/fine tuning bumpsteer.

[ChrisCar6]

What about using GP4 twin shear type steering arms rather than a high ratio rack? I see a number of advantages; adjustability of ratio range, use of female rod ends in place of MGB tre and further scope for adjusting/fine tuning bumpsteer.

Still would use the herald rack and track rods Colin - there must be an increase in forces from a Triumph herald on skinny tyres to a V6 Stratos on wide tyres?

[ByrneEngineering]

yea chris, absolutely, to be honest i'd had a few softy beers when i replied.. I was already planning on running m14 rod ends rather than the track rods. I've got no issues making up some shorter arms to improve the ratio, are there still issues with the original rack do you think? As i said already sorted out the column and uni joints to suit this rack. I've also read that escort racks are similar, same spline but different mounts? better option?

[ChrisCar6]

I agree it does sound like an exercise in liability management. I don't know how over-engineered the Herald rack is.
I've used the Rimmer rack without problem, but generally on smoother single-venue tarmac. Something like the Tour of Mull might be a different thing. Actually come to think of it I had to replace it after one of my bigger shunts at Chatsworth, but I had to replace my (standard) RS2000 rack after a lesser incident.
If an escort rack has suitable dimensions that fits and doesn't involve creating bumpsteer, then they are a tried and tested item.

[ByrneEngineering]

Next video, bit of a fix of some mismatched alfa parts I managed to end up with, finally got a new microphone, still playing with the settings but hopefully some much improved audio

https://youtu.be/hU_mF2YWagc (https://youtu.be/hU_mF2YWagc)

[LOFT6.6]

Next video, bit of a fix of some mismatched alfa parts of managed to end up with, finally got a new microphone, still playing with the settings but hopefully some much improved audio

https://youtu.be/hU_mF2YWagc (https://youtu.be/hU_mF2YWagc)

Nice one Colin. I wish I possessed 10% of your engineering skills mate! All I can manage are the safety beers......hic! Keep them coming and sound was perfect too.

[ByrneEngineering]

Thanks Ade. (the new mic cost 3 times more than my camera!)

Got the new gear shifter cables the other day so should be able to move back onto shifter and finish that up for the next vid

[Kenny m]

Great work I've been following the videos so far , always look forward to your progress. Keep up the good work and keep posting.

[ProtoTipo]

Colin,

Andy had to do some re-engineering on the same part for his Hawk. See here:
https://www.stratosec.com/Forum/showthread.php/1678-The-Alfa-V6-Build-Aseptogyl/page7

Although in his case it was prompted by the use of a sequential box.

Is your 6 speed Alfa gearbox from a 166?, as in, no diff. mount facility like a 156/GTA/GTV has?

[ProtoTipo]

Diff mount type:

[ByrneEngineering]

Interesting photos, yea so I started with a 5 speed and built the engine mounts thinking I was going to use that. Then the rules changed for our class and we could run a 6 speed. I could have fabricated a gearbox mount to suit the 6 speed but thought I'd try and recover the work I'd already done plus I think the way I have it setup now gives me some good exhaust routing options

[ProtoTipo]

Interesting photos, yea so I started with a 5 speed and built the engine mounts thinking I was going to use that. Then the rules changed for our class and we could run a 6 speed. I could have fabricated a gearbox mount to suit the 6 speed but thought I'd try and recover the work I'd already done plus I think the way I have it setup now gives me some good exhaust routing options

I understand.

The standard 166 6 speed set up, does have that alloy 'foot' mount on the right side.
The 156, 147, and 6 speed GTVs with the longer inter shaft don't. I would think the GT falls into that category too?

[ByrneEngineering]

Next video, got the cables so sorted out the other end of the shifter system, very happy with the result mostly as the gears appear to be in their correct location!

https://youtu.be/S7mL8TOcwwY

[Bernard]

Well Colin.... that's the best knob polishing I have ever seen !!.... LOL

Great work again.... nothing is impossible

Puts my Fiat resto to shame !

Cheers
Phil

[ByrneEngineering]

Practice mate, lots and lots of practice...

[ByrneEngineering]

Next episode, I get stuck into the exhaust


https://youtu.be/uBsv5I_VQNk

[Stratos Fear]

- great video - keep em coming! (good to see some Binky ideas incorporated) - and I like the safety beers .

[LPH_UK]

Great video yet again. I wish I had your machining and fabrication skills (and equipment)!

[ByrneEngineering]

cheers guys, ye the equipment is due to a crippling tool purchasing addiction, i then decide since i have them i should probably learn of to use them.... most of the time....

[ByrneEngineering]

In this one i get onto mounting the exhaust, was a bit trickier than i thought it would be actually
https://youtu.be/Hn9evLHqSdc (https://youtu.be/Hn9evLHqSdc)

[ByrneEngineering]

Next Video, sort out a some of the firewall and make a cover for the shifter cables


https://youtu.be/kDkH4EKK-ck

[ByrneEngineering]

Next Video, make up a couple of new fuel tanks

https://youtu.be/AJp_LKtFWgA

[LOFT6.6]

Great vids Col and pleased to say "safety" never far from your thoughts!

[Stratos Fear]

Good video - interesting . Presumably the tank tops will be the same grade of Al but thicker ?

[ByrneEngineering]

Thanks, yea correct, I'm designing up the top plate at the moment, had planned on making them from scratch, but struggling to find someone who will cut me out the thickness i want without using a shear, and i'm worried that will warp it to much, so thinking of getting them laser cut now, it's pretty cheap and will save me a lot of time

[LPH_UK]

Another great video that just makes me more annoyed I can't do stuff like this :D

[renmure]

It's all very clever and way beyond me.
I like the bit with the dog in it.
:D

[ByrneEngineering]

Cheers guys, yea that's my 13 year old German Sheppard, unfortunately she's getting a bit of doggy dementia so gets a bit clingy now, when trying to get a straight line on a manual bead roller nothing helps more than tripping over your dog

[ByrneEngineering]

Hi guys, next video of fitting out and mounting the tanks
https://youtu.be/CahziY4lG2k

[rdodger]

Awesome work as usual!

[Stratos Fear]

Great stuff Colin - keep 'em coming! It's getting a bit like Project Binky - cant wait for the next episode! Hope you dont take as long though!

[LPH_UK]

Great work as ever. I don't know why I can sit watching a bloke machining aluminium and find it so interesting :D.

Great position of the safety beer in shot too. Don't do beer whilst I'm working on the car (only afterwards) but some 'internet' friends who are following my long and arduous build over on a Lotus forum I'm a member of (ex-Lotus owner) did send me this!

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49909114377_7e1a791ea2_c.jpg

[Guy Mayers]

Love it! Should be standard issue with every kit!! Mine would be over 30 years old by now....

[ByrneEngineering]

It's getting a bit like Project Binky - cant wait for the next episode! Hope you dont take as long though!

Hopefully with the exculsion of an automatic flip front bonnet, it should be a little quicker, that was truly mental!


I don't know why I can sit watching a bloke machining aluminium and find it so interesting

I know, i find myself watching the footage intently, then i relies when i was actually doing it i couldn't wait for it to be finished!

[jeffdavison]

Brilliant talent and effort. Wish I had as much motivation!
JD

[LOFT6.6]

Great stuff as usual Col, all I managed this week was refitting a shower in the house, but did emulate the safety beers afterwards though........
Cheers!

[AndyGuyton]

Great stuff as usual Col, all I managed this week was refitting a shower in the house, but did emulate the safety beers afterwards though........
Cheers!

I have that job to look forward to...fixed the toilet though. ;)

[Stratos Fear]

some 'internet' friends who are following my long and arduous build over on a Lotus forum I'm a member of (ex-Lotus owner) did send me this!

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49909114377_7e1a791ea2_c.jpg

Leigh - love the special mug - where can I get one! This is the sentiment (if not the wording) of all my friends and relatives when enquiring about my never-ending garage activities !

[LPH_UK]

I can get some more I'm sure. I know the guy who made it. Anyone else want one? Sure we can censor the language. I'd like to show it to my son but he's a little bit young. Sure he knows the word but I'm still at the stage where I try to censor stuff for him!

[Stratos Fear]

Yes a version with a few asterisks suitably inserted might be a better bet! One for me please.

[ByrneEngineering]

Hi guys, next video of Mounting the ARB

https://youtu.be/QKuu8Zo4O4w

[Guy Mayers]

Pretty sure I saw a bracket there for the front ARB mount? Gerry supplies a kit with ally blocks (two halves to clamp around the ARB with a nylon sleeve to go over the ARB. If you use Gerry's kit though it's very very close to the rubber gaitors on the steering rack so you need to radius the corners to reduce/eliminate wear.
Guy

[ByrneEngineering]

mmm, don't think so? I've seen the ally blocks your talking about, and i think I've done my mounts in a similar place, there was definitely no mounting holes anywhere in the area, happy to be proved wrong though! From the pics i've seen the ally block through bolts go into threaded holes in the chassis? i thought about tracking down a kit, but will probably end up trying a few different bar diameters, so may not have ended up using much of it

[Guy Mayers]

Check the underside of the chassis where the forward bushing is for the upper wishbone pivot rod. There’s a plate running top right to bottom left. It ought to have a pair of holes in it. That’s where the blocks bolt to. Sure I saw it on the video!

[ProtoTipo]

Check the underside of the chassis where the forward bushing is for the upper wishbone pivot rod. There’s a plate running top right to bottom left. It ought to have a pair of holes in it. That’s where the blocks bolt to. Sure I saw it on the video!

This is what Guy means:

[ByrneEngineering]

nice, thanks, yea that gusset plate is there, no holes though, thought about mounting it there, can't actually remember why i didn't, sure i had a good reason, or maybe not.....

[Guy Mayers]

Probably because the nylon blocks you’ve gone for are too big to fit there? If you’ve got clearance on the pinion and u/j it’ll work fine! And thank for the pics Chris!

[ProtoTipo]

nice, thanks, yea that gusset plate is there, no holes though, thought about mounting it there, can't actually remember why i didn't, sure i had a good reason, or maybe not.....

Yes, my first Hawk (Safety Devices chassis) had the mounting plates, but no holes, and obviously no ARB fitted.

[ProtoTipo]

And thank for the pics Chris!

They're not mine Guy.
We should really thank Andy Phillips and Paul Ray from Detroit US.

[ByrneEngineering]

Hi guys, next episode, oil cooler mounting



https://youtu.be/zhyfgkoM4d0

[ByrneEngineering]

Hi guys, next episode, finish off the oil cooler
https://youtu.be/4B6fm9QhbaQ

[LOFT6.6]

Great stuff as always Col! Good to see supplies of SB's not affected by Lockdown. Stay safe mate!
Cheers!
Ade

[LPH_UK]

Love it.

Excellent fab skills yet again. And 2 safety beers!

[ByrneEngineering]

Next video, tackle some brake lines

https://youtu.be/kpPdw2sl0oc

[ByrneEngineering]

It's been a little while, but I'm back with a Stratos Tarmac Rally car update and Drive shaft fix number 2


https://youtu.be/2h3VOA0jqOg

[Stratos Fear]

Great video - and nice to know that precision engineering still occasionally requires the judicious use of a sledge hammer !

[LOFT6.6]

No wonder you've been AWOL Col, you've been busy constructing a whole new person!!!
Love the VID and the 3 safety beers of course.....
Congratulations.
Cheers!
Ade

[ByrneEngineering]

A precision sledge hammer of course! Cheers guys

[Stableblock]

Great video, was the other side as hard to separate (mine came apart much more easily, lol).
Keep them coming

Peter

[LPH_UK]

Another great video. The head falling off the sledge hammer was gold! I genuinely laughed out loud :D

[Guy Mayers]

Spoiler alert..... But yeah, me too!

[LPH_UK]

Spoiler alert..... But yeah, me too!

Oops! But there's so much more in it than just a broken sledge hammer.

[ByrneEngineering]

Haven't managed to separate the other cv yet, it might be getting to meet the angle soon.... The standard axle is to long anyway!
I think when you break your sledge hammer it's time for a different tactic

[Stableblock]

Thats very odd. I have done quite a few over the years and my normal problem is keeping them together whilst they are fitted. Do you think that the wrong circlips/clips were used on yours?

[ByrneEngineering]

Not sure about the Circlips, eventually cut one of the axles i didn't need to get the CV and my press couldn't push the stub of the axle out, machined it out on the lathe and on inspection the circlip was very deep in the groove, no way it was going to compress, you'd have to shear off the circlip to push it out

[ByrneEngineering]

In this episode I have a look at the fuel tank fittings and the spare wheel mount of the Tarmac rally Stratos, Happy Festivus!

https://youtu.be/OtcoOWPfilg

[LOFT6.6]

In this episode I have a look at the fuel tank fittings and the spare wheel mount of the Tarmac rally Stratos, Happy Festivus!

https://youtu.be/OtcoOWPfilg

Enjoyed your festive offering Col. Just spoke to my daughter yesterday who lives and works in Sydney, complaining about a sunburnt nose!! She agreed that this was not very Christmasy. Today we awoke in the North East of England to a sprinkling of snow - that's more like it!

Happy Christmas to all - both Down Under and across the remainder of the Stratos world!

Cheers!

Ade

[ByrneEngineering]

So I totally forgot you need an alternator and the original one on the engine didn't fit, so this episode i tackle the that situation
https://youtu.be/0DiojvVLFAI (https://youtu.be/0DiojvVLFAI)

[ducatiman]

I have had the same problem as well on the alternator.................I would like to have gone for 240 Amps after doing some initial calculations of possible loads on my build but I am struggling to find a high output small compact unit. Therefore I had to compromise and go for a 175 Amp. The unit that I purchased is below as it will fit in the restricted space both in length and diameter:

WOSP LMA300HO - Universal Race Alternator (https://www.ccw-tools.com/Product.aspx?ProductID=46944)

Just drawing up required new mounting brackets................

[Stratos Fear]

Neat solution for mounting the alternator - but maybe a daft question - Why didnt you attach the alternator protective cover to the chassis instead of the alternator/engine block ? Surely that would reduce the risk of shattering the alternator end housing?

[ByrneEngineering]

WOSP LMA300HO - Universal Race Alternator (https://www.ccw-tools.com/Product.aspx?ProductID=46944)

that is certainly a lot of Amps! good find, not exactly the cheapest unit in the world though!


Why didn't you attach the alternator protective cover to the chassis instead of the alternator/engine block
Good Question, I did look at that option for a long time. Problem I was seeing is that if i mounted it to the chassis, I've got to allow for movement between the cover and the belt drive, so I couldn't have a close fitting cover, so to get the same protection I'd have ended up with a massive cover, and then i was running into also sorts of clearance issues with the fuel tank, exhaust and strut.
As you say there is always the risk of shattering the alt. housing, but the cover is very light, and the lip buts up against the alternator and block, so its not bouncing around on the studs, I think that risk is fairly low.

[LPH_UK]

Nice work yet again.

Is it me or does your band saw seem to move around a lot?!

[ByrneEngineering]

Yep, that overworked little bandsaw is not the most stable thing in the world, it's on wheels, which dosn't 't help, I've got a proper vertical bandsaw sitting on my trailer, but it's massive and I need some help getting it into the workshop

[LPH_UK]

Wheels would explain it somewhat!

Jealous of your workshop though. I have a small pillar drill and a bench vice and that's it apart from the usual hand tools. Oh I do have a small compressor too.....

[ByrneEngineering]

Next Video, I have a look at a wheel bearing issue

https://youtu.be/Z7rp34zyhQc

[LOFT6.6]

Col, thats perseverance for you. I would have needed a slab of safety beers before considering that task and still wouldn't have had the skills to complete it.....Well done!
Cheers Ade

[colin artus]

While you're beefing things up at the front, the chassis mount for the tie bar needs reinforcing on early Spyder chassis. Of course if you are using an r/j then you have probably sidestepped this problem already. Keep up the good work!

[ByrneEngineering]

Ade, if you count the safty beers i drank as i flew into a furious rage after i discovered the issue, that estimation would be fairly accurate...


While you're beefing things up at the front, the chassis mount for the tie bar needs reinforcing on early Spyder chassis. Of course if you are using an r/j then you have probably sidestepped this problem already

Are you talking about the front lower "caster" arm? Yea I've already made significant changes to that, No rose joint as i'm trying to keep at least one end of every arm with some sort of bushing as I've had serious issues with fatigue on totally rose jointed rally car suspension before. Anyway, the body mount has been modified for a bushing and the whole area has been beefed up a bit, thanks for the heads up though

[Stableblock]

Garage tour video would be good thanks Colin. As you say that play on the bearings is surprising. Cant say I noticed it on Beta originals. Will have to check mine when it goes together again.
Peter

[Stratos Fear]

Another great vid - I'm full of admiration for your ingenuity and technical skills ! Yes I'd be interested to join the garage tour.
P

[ByrneEngineering]

Cheers guys, garage tour seems to be a popular suggestion, so we'll definitely make it happen. As for the bearings although fixed I'm still perplexed as to the cause, and wouldn't be surprised if your beta bearings are fine. I'll definitely try a different brand next time around, I'd looked for Timkin but couldn't find any, my dad has since located some.

[LPH_UK]

As has already been said, great video. Love the lateral thinking to sort stuff and the cylindrical dremel grinder was a stroke of genius!

Those bearings were bloody awful, no idea why they were that bad especially for a decent brand like SKF.

[Stratos Fear]

Those bearings were bloody awful, no idea why they were that bad especially for a decent brand like SKF.

- maybe Chinese knock-offs?

[ByrneEngineering]

cylindrical dremel grinder was a stroke of genius!
It worked a lot better than I thought it would!

- maybe Chinese knock-offs?
I was thinking the same thing, so for the replacement one I got it through an skf dealer who ordered it directly from skf Australia, so you'd hope they are legit

[ByrneEngineering]

With only a couple of small jobs to tidy up this episode I thought we could have a walk around the workshop and checkout the tools i've been
using to build the Stratos tarmac Rally car

https://youtu.be/MwWIooA6XWI

[Guy Mayers]

Oh crap. I've got two cars in a single garage. Where the hell do i put the obligatory beer fridge?

[Stableblock]

Excellent, thanks Colin, you've packed a load of kit in there. Out of interest how big is your machine shop area?

[LOFT6.6]

Thanks for the tour Col. Very impressive..........beer fridge! ��
Cheers!
Ade

[ByrneEngineering]

Oh crap. I've got two cars in a single garage. Where the hell do i put the obligatory beer fridge?
I don't know but that's a bloody dangerous situation that you need to sort out!


Out of interest how big is your machine shop area?
It's a bit of a funny shape, with 1 wall on a diagonal, but it would be around the same as a 1.5 standard garage I guess


Thanks for the tour Col. Very impressive..........beer fridge!
No worries, was definitely the easiest video I've made, didn't have to fabricate anything and just talked tools and drank beer, pretty much a perfect Friday night!

[ByrneEngineering]

Next Video, with the mounts finished off in a previous video, seemed rude not to actually fit some ARB's

https://youtu.be/b7nz93pA_hU

[ByrneEngineering]

In this episode i attempt to get some cooler air in to the engine of the Tarmac Rally Stratos

https://youtu.be/u1RXrJgyj0Q (https://youtu.be/u1RXrJgyj0Q)

[colin artus]

When you dyno the engine try it with and without your magnificent airbox construction and see how much difference it makes; restriction versus cool air, which will win?

[Stratos Fear]

- another great episode - I love the precision and the excellent fabrication work. Will you be enhancing / modifying the roof wing to direct the airflow ?

[LPH_UK]

Cracking job!

[ByrneEngineering]

Cheers guys


When you dyno the engine try it with and without your magnificent airbox construction and see how much difference it makes; restriction versus cool air, which will win?

I'll definitely give it a go, although a hot dyno room on a rolling road with no real airflow might not give a fair result, but interesting to see if there is much restriction anyway


Will you be enhancing / modifying the roof wing to direct the airflow ?

Yea that is something I've been giving a lot of thought about, and it is definitely on the cards (I do like the look of the air ducts as they are now though)

[ByrneEngineering]

New Vid

It's finally Time to strip down the Tarmac Rally Stratos and get it ready for some paint, of course still plenty of stuff to fabricate along the way

https://youtu.be/EtpCsH2r5xU

[LOFT6.6]

Another great vid Col, thanks! Must admit I didn't understand much in the middle section, but can't wait to see your n'th number of pixel colours display operating.
Cheers
Ade

[ByrneEngineering]

Thanks mate, haha yea think i lost a few there, might have to split the videos up to follow my split engineering personality!
cheers

[LPH_UK]

Great work on the shock mount strengthening. That certainly shouldn't bow like the original!

[ProtoTipo]

Great work on the shock mount strengthening. That vcertianly shouldn't bow like the original!

I had one Spyder, and three Safety Devices chassis, and none of them had strut tops like that.
They were all like this:

[Guy Mayers]

Mine's almost 30 years on the road, 90k Miles and no signs of any bowed suspension mounts... The only suspension repair it's had in that time is a strengthening plate needed on the front link that wasn't up to the job of uprated brakes. Plate supplied by Gerry as a recall mod if my memory is correct!
Guy

[ByrneEngineering]

Yea I've noticed from a lot of pics that most cars seem to have some little triangle gussets at each end of the plate, mine didn't have that, maybe a la upgrade? anyway like I said I needed a dirty great big hole in the top to pass the reservoirs through, and even in the alfa it wasn't not uncommon to get completely airborne on some of the rally stages, so I bit of extra strength in that area can't hurt
cheers

[ByrneEngineering]

Next video


No Paint yet, sorry but so close!


https://youtu.be/ArC21CEsIcw

[ByrneEngineering]

Sorry guys, been a while, but plenty has been going on

https://youtu.be/m9KlSL3lKWA

[Stableblock]

Thanks Colin, another very interesting episode. Looks like you are on the home straight now.

[LOFT6.6]

Col, love the colour and all looking very neat. Didn't understand a word on your wiring module section except the words; relays, fuses and wire. Also cam and bus mean something totally different to me.... ;-)
Great work as always Col, looking forward to your engine install vid mate.
Cheers!
Ade

[Stratos Fear]

Is there nothing automotive that this man cant do ! I'm impressed Colin - you have all the skills for car building that I wish I had - I liked the electronic stuff you did (but didnt understand the technicalities) - well done and a LOT faster than the Binky guys !

[ByrneEngineering]

Thanks very much guys, haha yea I thought I might get the engine going before binky, it was close, but they finally got there!

[LPH_UK]

Impressive work as ever Colin!

[ByrneEngineering]

Not a full episode, engine's not in yet, but a quick video fitting some new coils to the Busso

https://youtu.be/WZ-XXfhNV3Q

[ByrneEngineering]

Hey LPH, just realised your profile pic is running those coils! Hopefully they worked out OK?

[renmure]

I hate contributing to technical stuff 'cause usually I know less than mince but I'm pretty confident Craig fitted the Audi R8 coils to my set-up and I believe they work fabulously.

https://i.imgur.com/gSWNJjb.jpg

[LPH_UK]

Hey LPH, just realised your profile pic is running those coils! Hopefully they worked out OK?

Hi Colin

Yep, mine uses those coils. They seem to work great!

Leigh

[Strat Fan]

Hey LPH, just realised your profile pic is running those coils! Hopefully they worked out OK?
I think Neil Turbonutter was the first on here to fit the Audi coils to the Alfa V6 as far back in 2014. STR Strat followed suit on his first build shortly afterwards.
In both cases they used machined sleeves pressed into the rocker covers to help prevent water ingress down the plug wells

[LPH_UK]

Yeah, I can't claim the idea!

[ByrneEngineering]

Thanks guys, yea that all in one cover/mounting plate is a very slick solution!, that might have to wait until i get my CNC mill operational. Thanks for the heads up re sealing around the stalk, I thought there was already a decent fit there, but on more careful inspection there is indeed a gap, I'll make up some sleeves as suggested to keep the H2O out, cheers

[ByrneEngineering]

Next video, finally got the springs and dampers, been waiting on these for ages!

https://youtu.be/8iAowvPqJHU

[Guy Mayers]

Excellent progress again but did I see the front lower balljoint sitting on top of the transverse arm? I think it's supposed to be bolted in from underneath so that if anything breaks free the ring in the transverse arm can capture some of the slack before it all goes horribly wrong?

Guy

[ByrneEngineering]

Hi Guys, I know it's been a while, but here you go, the final instalment! thanks for following along!

https://youtu.be/aMErXSMOOlk

[LOFT6.6]

Congratulations Col in getting your Stratos rebuild "finished"! Loved following the build on your YT Channel. Please keep us up to date with your competition progress mate. Will lift a Safety Beer to your success when the hour is more acceptable in the UK.
Cheers!
Ade

[Stratos Fear]

Great vid. Loved the little tweaks - and the hose cutter - brilliant ! Enjoy the car and please keep us posted on your progress - and hopefully, success with it.

[rdodger]

Brilliant. Thanks for sharing. I have really enjoyed the whole build. Good luck with the Rally!

[LPH_UK]

Great stuff. Looks like it shifts pretty well!

Been great watching your videos. Keep us updated on any events you take it to.

[ByrneEngineering]

Thanks guys, We are madly running around trying to get ready for its first rally in 2 weeks, Targa High Country. Not expecting any great results and treating it more as a shake down for Targa Tasmania later this year.

I'll make sure to post some updates


Looks like it shifts pretty well
I am amazed (and very happy) with how well it shifts, super precise good short throw, and gear shifter is in a nice spot.

[Ken Tomblin]

Brilliant Colin. Love all the mods plus the lathe hose cutter “magic” best of luck in the rally.
could you provide more details on you’re gear box stiffening mod and the top mounting bracket that you fabricated for the front damper mount.

Kind regards Ken.

[ByrneEngineering]

Hi Ken
Re the gearbox, we pulled the rear cover off to see what could be causing failures that we had heard about and noticed that there was minimal material between the 2 shaft end bearings. The main forces the end case has to contend with are the 2 shafts pushing apart so decided to try and reinforce the bearing housings. We cut out a thick ali plate, cleaned up the casting and welded it on the outside, to create a sort of "strap" between the 2 bearings. It weld on very well, and no issues with warping. I'll try and dig up a few photo's of the fix, i think my dad has some

the top mounting bracket for the dampers was a basic box section, just spent a long time making sure the damper would clear the top arm. Since i cut out the fiberglass section that goes around the spare wheel and replaced it with a steel section, that section of the front chassis is very strong now
cheers

[Ken Tomblin]

Hi Colin. Any photo,s would be be very helpful on both mods as I am trying to replicate them on my Hawk.

Kind regards Ken.

[Bernard]

Congratulations Colin, its been great to watch your progress this last couple of years....
Cheers
Phil

[ByrneEngineering]

here's a good shot of the gearbox sterngthing plate, we milled it out of a 12mm plate so we could leave a 6mm edge to aid with welding and leave a 12mm rib, but that was overkill and due to a crippling Milling machine addiction, a simple 6mm plate would have been fine

19166

Some more pics of the front strut mount to follow
cheers

[Basher]

Colin, Enjoyed a brilliant compilation of videos, the car looks and sounds great , good luck on the rallies , Cheers

[Stableblock]

Thanks Colin, Its been great to follow your rebuild and see everything you have done. I imagine I'm not alone with my workshop (and skills) envy! Good luck with your season.

Best wishes

Peter

[Strat Fan]

here's a good shot of the gearbox sterngthing plate, we milled it out of a 12mm plate so we could leave a 6mm edge to aid with welding and leave a 12mm rib, but that was overkill and due to a crippling Milling machine addiction, a simple 6mm plate would have been fine


cheers
I haven't actually seen an Alfa box fail in the bearing area but I have seen a couple that have worn through from rubbing on the inner wings when the top engine steady in the donor car fails.
19167
The one I have seen that failed in a Stratos replica (former member on here) was much more catastrophic and the weak point was actually around the outer edge of the end casing.
The increased traction of the mid engined layout must have been too much and the thrust put back up the shaft from the crown wheel was too great for the casing.
The old 164 gearboxes were much stronger in this area where they had the additional bolt on end casing.
19168

[Guy Mayers]

Isn't there a similar problem with Integrale boxes on uprated cars? I have a vague memory of casings being machined around bearing houses to accept a sandwiched steel plate to strengthen them.

[Strat Fan]

Isn't there a similar problem with Integrale boxes on uprated cars? I have a vague memory of casings being machined around bearing houses to accept a sandwiched steel plate to strengthen them.
I can't comment on the Integrale but there is the 3mm steel strengthening plate which can be added to Fiat/Alfa boxes between the bell housing and the gearbox casing which is used to help prevent the diff/crown wheel from separating from the pinion shaft. This requires 3mm to be machined from the gearbox casing to me it fit.
Neil did this to his old 164 box. That bit didn't fail but he stripped 4th gear shortly after....
1916919170

[westonTB]

Thanks Colin, I have learnt a lot from watching all your video's and the 105 Alfa stuff, 2 years & on the track = Result! Me = 6 years in and still bleeding air out me brakes!!! = idiot.

More Beer needed to help I think.

[Bernard]

If I remember correctly when he machined Erics gearbox for me he took 1.5 off the bell housing and 1.5 off the Gearbox casing.


I can't comment on the Integrale but there is the 3mm steel strengthening plate which can be added to Fiat/Alfa boxes between the bell housing and the gearbox casing which is used to help prevent the diff/crown wheel from separating from the pinion shaft. This requires 3mm to be machined from the gearbox casing to me it fit.
Neil did this to his old 164 box. That bit didn't fail but he stripped 4th gear shortly after....
1916919170

[Strat Fan]

If I remember correctly when he machined Erics gearbox for me he took 1.5 off the bell housing and 1.5 off the Gearbox casing.
It sounds viable, I've never had one done.

[ByrneEngineering]

The one I have seen that failed in a Stratos replica (former member on here) was much more catastrophic and the weak point was actually around the outer edge of the end casing.
The increased traction of the mid engined layout must have been too much and the thrust put back up the shaft from the crown wheel was too great for the casing.
So this was the sort of failure we were attempting to avoid with the additional strap


Now 'm not saying this is absolutely correct, but here was our thinking on the situation


- the failed section is after the gearbox mount, so it won't be subject to any loads generated between the diff output to the chassis


- the only Force that part of the gearbox casting is subject to is created from the gear shaft bearings


- As the gears are loaded up the shafts will try and spread apart, this is reacted by the bearing housings in the casting


So our thoughts were, a failure occurred in the casting between the 2 bearings, as mentioned it is very very thin in there, once a crack formed the 2 gears spread apart further and caused the carnage seen in that photo


What would be super helpful would be a photo of the failed casting parts, if the 2 bearing housing are still attached together in the end plate that would falsify our theory

[Strat Fan]

So this was the sort of failure we were attempting to avoid with the additional strap


Now 'm not saying this is absolutely correct, but here was our thinking on the situation


- the failed section is after the gearbox mount, so it won't be subject to any loads generated between the diff output to the chassis


- the only Force that part of the gearbox casting is subject to is created from the gear shaft bearings


- As the gears are loaded up the shafts will try and spread apart, this is reacted by the bearing housings in the casting


So our thoughts were, a failure occurred in the casting between the 2 bearings, as mentioned it is very very thin in there, once a crack formed the 2 gears spread apart further and caused the carnage seen in that photo


What would be super helpful would be a photo of the failed casting parts, if the 2 bearing housing are still attached together in the end plate that would falsify our theory
I haven't got any other pics of the failure so can't comment on what the other piece looked like.
You can try DM'ing the owner, Sando on here but he sold his car a couple of years back and hasn't checked into the forum since Nov 2020.
You may be right on the failure being caused by the shafts trying to separate, I was thinking it was related to the thrust on the shafts induced by the helical cut of the gears/crown wheel.

[Stableblock]

There will also be an axial thrust from the taper roller bearings tending to push the end off the casing. Your mod will help that by reducing the bending of the casing but ultimately the same forces have to be accommodated somewhere. As you say Colin more pics of the failure would help identify the cause.

[ProtoTipo]

Here's a 3.2 GT box (https://scontent-lcy1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.6435-9/fr/cp0/e15/q65/69868315_2727332150612509_7574443030023766016_n.jpg?_nc_cat=106&ccb=1-5&_nc_sid=8024bb&_nc_ohc=ZqF_fupivM8AX-FXRh_&_nc_ht=scontent-lcy1-1.xx&oh=00_AT_pTOROIEKrEFePDrapht2Qp1qxXOo-9WI5iUNCOJKOAA&oe=621F73BA)

[Stableblock]

Thanks Chris, thats interesting. I note the extra ribs on the RHS of the end casing casting but nothing equivalent on the left. Maybe its all a bit marginal in that area. I suppose we will never really know. It will be interesting to see how Colin's box and mod stands up to some hard use.

[LPH_UK]

Why am I reading this thread.....

Just something else to worry about!

[ProtoTipo]

Why am I reading this thread.....

Just something else to worry about!

Leigh, I understand that you have to be very brutal with the transmission, for this to happen.
As Chris Savage has pointed out, a mid engined car does have more 'bite' than a FWD car, when it comes to driven axle grip.
Having said that, I did see an account (only one) on one of the Alfa forums, of a 156 2.5 owner that did exactly the same thing (see Craig's photo above) with a split right round the gearbox casing.

[ByrneEngineering]

Couldn't resist one more video, a quick clip video of the project

https://youtu.be/YSbCe7jHsv4

[NoCorseChris]

I think by far the best mod for the gearbox is the one Neil ended up doing, swap if for an MR2 turbo unit.

[westonTB]

Brilliant vid Colin, especially the onboards. Wish I could get my kids to pass me a spanner!

Looking forward to future rally clips etc.

Cheers!

[ByrneEngineering]

Update video soon, but in the meantime is some of the video of the Stratos @ Targa Tasmania

enjoy!

https://youtu.be/ZYpVOEra3q0

[renmure]

Looks great and sounds great!!

Great video tho. When I imagine a Stratos bombing along that's what it looks like.

[LPH_UK]

Great video. Looks like it handles really well.

[Bernard]

Excellent !......... time to enjoy all your hard work

[Guy Mayers]

Glad to see a lack of safety beers on this video! Enjoy!

[Basher]

Nice to see the old girl out, awesome good job you did building that:cool:

[LOFT6.6]

Great to see the car in action Col. Looks to handle so well and you must be very pleased with how your hard work is translating into the track/road?
Thanks for sharing.
Cheers!
Ade

[rutthenut]

Looks great Colin, nice to see a Stradale-bodied car in action for a change ;)

I know you've got some decent dampers on there, but what spring rates did you go for on front and rear, car looks well balanced?

[ByrneEngineering]

Thanks guys
Yea the car handles very well straight out of the box, running
325lbs front
250lbs rear
I was aiming for a ride frequency of around 2, but I think the car may be a little lighter than I’d estimated, unfortunately due to a comedy of errors I still haven’t had a change to get it onto some corner weights.
As you can see from the vidoes, the car has epic turn in, which is great, but a little hard to read, I’d like to try dropping the front roll centre a little, from my calcs I think I can drop it down by 60mm without going below the ground, I think this would slow the front down a little and give better feedback
Conversely, I’d like to try and raise the rear roll center to limit its ability to drop below the ground level, It’s very tricky to control the roll centre migration on a McPherson strut, but raising the roll center may make the rear harder to read, just something to try
The Balance is good at the moment, so I think my ARB calcs we’re pretty close, if/when I make changes to the roll centres I’ll have to compensate with new ARB’s, that is if we ever get to do another tarmac rally in Australia……..

[rutthenut]

that is if we ever get to do another tarmac rally in Australia……..

Do hope so.
Unfortunate outcome on Targa shouldn't prevent future events, perhaps just with more controls to limit speed, increase safety, somehow.

[ChrisCar6]

Did the chin spoiler survive the event?
What tyres did you use?

[ByrneEngineering]

Yea chin spoiler survived no problem, couple of scrapes, but it was always going to be a bit of a consumable.

We are running 205/55 R16 Dunlop DZO3G softs and have a 215/50 R16 mediums for the rear for longer stages
Awsome tyres

[ByrneEngineering]

Bit of an upgrade video on the individual throttle bodies, hopefully more videos to follow

https://youtu.be/NOcr2Ca2pQE

[Stableblock]

Thanks Colin, another interesting video. have you changed your safety beer?

[Stratos Fear]

Another excellent video - I love the quality of your techy stuff - very inspiring !

[hollytree]

It has inspired me enough to stay with the standard plenum and and maf setup etc.
Beautiful engineering though

[LPH_UK]

Brilliant work as ever - thanks for producing these videos!

You are dead right about the PITA it is to balance 6 ITBs. Mine caused me no end of issues but got there eventually. I'm lucky that I have a DBW throttle and use that to control idle, so no need for all the vacuum lines on mine. Seems to work well though.

And I also noticed your new safety beer of choice appears to be VB.

[rutthenut]

Dunno about the Alfa ITB setup, but the ecu on my Manta V6 engine (with plenum) just uses ignition for idle control, so no vacuum lines and no idle valve.
Makes it a little lumpy with some rise-and-fall in the revs, but seems to work well enough in that case.

[LPH_UK]

The Emerald ECU I had on a Lotus (4 cyl k series rover eng) did the same. Lovely angry lumpy idle, helped by the aggressive cams.

[ByrneEngineering]

No worries guys, glad your enjoying the vids, i've got another one done, just got to edit it down. Yep, different safety beer indeed!, Always been partial to the old VB, I am from Victoria!

yea 6 ITB, OMG what a pain, i can set up a pair of twin Webers with my eyes closed on a hangover, but 2 banks of 3 throttles nearly sent me off the deep end.....

Re the use of ignition modulation to control the idle, yep definitely an option, I mucked around with it for a while but it's a bit limiting on how much range you can get and I found the V6 wanted a pretty high idle when it first started, my aim was to be able to start the car without touching the throttle and with the ignition alone i just couldn't get this to happen, particular when it was dead cold

cheers guys

[ByrneEngineering]

New Video!

I broke the Shifter Housing I used (original alfa part) at a track day @ Phillip Island, so I made a new one

out of Aluminimum...

https://youtu.be/k5GeCBSusE8

[Stratos Fear]

Brilliant - a lovely bit of neat engineering !

[rutthenut]

That's neat, looks and sounds much more purposeful than the old plastic moulding.
The spring for self-centering seems a great idea too.
Mine has a different linkage (rods, not cable) and there isn't much throw from left to right between 1-2/3-4/5-6 planes, so that spring must help a lot.

[AndyLB]

Fascinating to watch - great ingenuity!!

[ByrneEngineering]

Glad you enjoyed the vid,

Yea i think that additional spring will make a big difference, it was actually pretty finicky to setup, the little stopper block, that limits the spring rotation, has to be just the right width to get the spring start doing something straight away.

[ByrneEngineering]

So have been having a closer look at the Suspension Geometry and decided to make a few Changes to try and Settle this thing down a bit!

https://youtu.be/FUUFEYLwkVU

[Stableblock]

Yet another very interesting video thanks Colin. It will be really interesting to see what difference your mods have made. Has this changed the ride height at either end? I know I should be able to work it out but sadly dont have a beer to hand.

[ByrneEngineering]

Thanks mate, na both those changes won't directly effect ride height.

[Stratos Fear]

Fascinating video Colin - it'll be interesting to see what effect these changes have - and if your theories prove correct !

[sean999r]

Good video, Porsche 911's similar weight distribution typically have rear RC 12-15" above ground.

[rutthenut]

Interesting video.

For the rear wishbones, do you have alternative inner mounts?

One thing to watch when setting up the rear suspension is to ensure you still have enough clearance for plunge on the driveshaft/CV joints. Playing with camber of wishbone angle can affect that. Though given your other attention to detail, I doubt you would have issues with that.

The short wheelbase certainly contributes to fore-and-aft weight transfer, and the strut-type rear means camber change happens in roll, so nothing is ever ideal. The high C-of-G with the V6 doesn't help either, can certainly feel that weight sitting just behind your shoulders

[ByrneEngineering]

Good video, Porsche 911's similar weight distribution typically have rear RC 12-15" above ground.


Really, That sounds very high?



Interesting video.


For the rear wishbones, do you have alternative inner mounts?


One thing to watch when setting up the rear suspension is to ensure you still have enough clearance for plunge on the driveshaft/CV joints. Playing with camber of wishbone angle can affect that. Though given your other attention to detail, I doubt you would have issues with that.


The short wheelbase certainly contributes to fore-and-aft weight transfer, and the strut-type rear means camber change happens in roll, so nothing is ever ideal. The high C-of-G with the V6 doesn't help either, can certainly feel that weight sitting just behind your shoulders


Yea Rear Wishbone Inner Mounts are a nolathane Bush from a Holden Commodore Pan Hard Rod, Its just a good sized bush, easy to get, used them for a long time on the Alfa


All good on the plunge of the driveshaft, but good point


Yea the Short Wheelbase definitely makes the vehicle far more sensitive to this sort of stuff, and as you say there are a lot of compromises with Strut Type suspension, Roll Centre Migration is a big issue, particularly with such short bottom arms

[rutthenut]

Yea Rear Wishbone Inner Mounts are a nolathane Bush from a Holden Commodore Pan Hard Rod, Its just a good sized bush, easy to get, used them for a long time on the Alfa


Sorry, I meant to ask if you had alternative mounting points on the chassis.
My car, which I think is a later one, has two points for the inner wishbone, and for the long rear track control arm.

So rather than extend the hub carrier downwards, can choose higher or lower inner mounting point for the wishbone to change the angle.

Also, mine has spherical joints on the chassis end, with some hard poly-style bushes on the outer, fwiw.
Did have to replace some recently as there was some slight play and it allowed a bit of rear-wheel steer, with angles changing under throttle and brakes, which is not ideal :)

[ByrneEngineering]

Yea my chassis mounting points are in the same spot, I have made the rear mount removable, it was an attempt to get more camber adjustment, but limited by drive shaft length. My first idea was to move that point up, as you suggest, but quickly run into the drive shaft CV

[tommy]

Thanks for all your great videos. This one is especially excellent. They are very helpful in getting the Hawk running.


If only we could fabricate longer driveshafts, we could use longer lower arms to reduce the detrimental geometry change itself.


If we can make it into a Group 4 fender, we can extend it by about 60mm on each side.


Does Hawk have any extended lower arms for Group 4 fenders as a retrofit part? Maybe I just don't know.


I'm sure you could make a lower arm with a beer in your hand. ��


Wishing you all the best for the future!

[ByrneEngineering]

Cheers mate, glad the vids are useful to you.

Yea longer arms would be great, I've made new bottom arms and got them as long as I could, longer than the original Hawk, The limiting factor for me was the Wheel offset, brake calliper and disc i'm running, rather than the driveshafts as I've got some custom ones

[rutthenut]

If only we could fabricate longer driveshafts, we could use longer lower arms to reduce the detrimental geometry change itself.

Does Hawk have any extended lower arms for Group 4 fenders as a retrofit part? Maybe I just don't know.

Moving the hub carrier out into a wider wheelarch wouldn't be a great solution, especially when considering this is a strut-type suspension setup. Smaller changes possible with some rework, but hard to quantify the returns.

Hawk have made some chassis with the lower rails closer together around the engine bay in the past, but only as a special for a Ferrari-engined kit. That allowed for longer wishbones (and driveshafts), with inner pivot point closer to the CV joint of the driveshaft which reduces plunge as shaft and wishbone nearer to being parallel to each other.

That's definitely not a retrofit part and would be a lot of work, with less scope under and around the Alfa sump to get a lot of benefit.

In most cases, drivers would never be able to tell the difference. With 'less than ideal' suspension geometry, the Stratos replica has better handling than many (most) drivers are capable of using. And even with changes to improve the theoretical behaviour of the suspension angles, the character of the car itself will - and should - remain as something that can change direction quickly and rapidly. It was designed for rallying, which required low polar moments of inertia and great responsiveness. It's not supposed to be an understeer-heavy fwd-style chassis designed to save drivers from themselves...

That's not to say making changes won't be worthwhile and all kudos to Colin for working this stuff out and applying great engineering to modify things in his desire to improve the car to his liking and for his needs.

(After all, it may be a twitchy car, but getting that more predictable and controllable at the limit has to be a good target)