View Full Version : Corse (?) For Sale - ?15,000
Guy Mayers
14-12-2022, 21:07
Based in Shrewsbury it needs a full rebuild. Luckily it's already in bits.
https://www.facebook.com/commerce/listing/2310815939093741/?media_id=0&ref=share_attachment
No connection to the seller.
Guy
Darkspeed
14-12-2022, 21:46
And another even closer than the last one
That front end looks very
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Even has the big wing sneaking in
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Optimistic - anyone know it?
Strat Fan
14-12-2022, 22:03
Corse GTO-
Quite a successful car in its day, Italian Intermark & British GT competitor. It is looking a bit sorry for itself these days though judging from those pics.
I worked on this chassis back in the day circa 1993/4. Lionel (Napiersport) was originally Litton cars southern agent, he ultimately purchased the original yellow demonstrator from Litton cars.
At some point in the early '90's this car was lost to a fire I think and the resultant insurance claim allowed Lionel to buy a replacement rolling chassis assembly from CAE.
This chassis was in the CAE workshops when I got back involved after being away at college. It was painted red at the time.
Once down south it evolved from a rally car thru to a semi successful circuit racer.
The front spoiler can be supplied on request.
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The replacement kit acquired by Lionel after UDN went up in flames actually became the so called 'Evo' Grp5 replica.
This particular car started life as Lionels Road car and evolved into a racecar under the Hennessey Racing banner , raced by Chris Snowdon and Tony Soper amongst others.
It was acquired by Graham Scott and raced in the Autoitalia series.
It was crashed at Donnington (?) and later brought to Cheshire for restoration/repair, but as I understand it costs and schedule of work could not be agreed and the project was abandoned.
Last time I saw it it was in lockup garage in Dorset. I did approach the owner with a view to acquiring it at that time but didn't get a response. I was told a few years back that it had been scrapped but obviously not.
There may even still be a valid V5 for this car somewhere.
Darkspeed
14-12-2022, 22:33
I'm guessing it would have been road registered when being used as a rally car - but then not as the race car ! Chassis looks very similar - even with the poor focus
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Darkspeed
14-12-2022, 22:41
https://www.flickr.com/photos/michaelwardphotos/3227845819/in/photostream/
Looks to have been a very nice car at one point
I'm guessing it would have been road registered when being used as a rally car - but then not as the race car ! Chassis looks very similar - even with the poor focus
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I think Lionel still has the V5 though. Probably it became a racecar pre-SORN era?
And knowing Lionels paperwork standards the V5 has been shoved in draw and forgotten about.
Darkspeed
14-12-2022, 23:04
Something and nothing for ?15,000 - but how do you value something like that ?
https://www.flickr.com/photos/michaelwardphotos/3227845819/in/photostream/
Looks to have been a very nice car at one point
Yes, some nice photos in there.
Including one of Rut the Nut in a Spin!?
Or was it the other guy......?
I know John had robust views about the way the Corse was driven in the Autoitalia series. Best not drag that subject up again.
Vendor tells me the car still has its dog engagement box.
Strat Fan
14-12-2022, 23:32
The replacement kit acquired by Lionel after UDN went up in flames actually became the so called 'Evo' Grp5 replica.
No, it did not.
The Gp5 EVO was built from a Corse "I" Ferrari chassis which was a cancelled order from Japan.
This chassis was also supplied to Lionel from CAE..
The red chassis which became the GTO was a Corse "S" chassis and was known as the "insurance job"
Not what Lionel told me.
Nor what the photo records he showed me would suggest. But, what accurate informative came from his lips anyway.....
Hang on. I seem to recall the insurance chassis went to Andrew Dearing? Or again what I was told.
Strat Fan
15-12-2022, 07:43
Nor what the photo records he showed me would suggest.
The Corse EVO Chassis-
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The Corse I chassis it was built from-
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I'm not sure what photo records suggest otherwise.
There were only 4 Corse I Ferrari chassis made that I am aware of.
The first was modified back to an Alfa and is now in the US,
The 2nd is the one under the EVO
The 3rd is in Japan
The 4th I think is now also in Japan after languishing in a barn in the UK for many years.
ProtoTipo
15-12-2022, 08:08
A photo I took of the GTO in the paddock, when I went to watch John Rutter race his Hawk at Cadwell:
I'm well aware the Evo was built from an I type chassis.
What I was referring to was that UDN's demise led to Lionel starting the Evo project.
The insurance job replacement S chassis went to Andrew Dearing/Tony Favarin as far as I am aware, through Lionel, and that led on to Lionel acquiring the Evo I chassis. I'm pretty certain the replacement S chassis is not what we see under the GTO.
Lionel showed me his own photo album which showed his road car (probably contemporaneous with UDN) which certainly showed development firstly into a rally ar and then into a racecar.
He wrote all this down once I believe but given his propensity for rewriting history then anything could be true.
ProtoTipo
15-12-2022, 13:14
I've compared the dash shown in the photos of this car currently for sale, with the period photos of the cockpit of the Tony Soper car.
All the dash instruments match.
Guy Mayers
15-12-2022, 15:02
Was this car ever road registered? If Lionel has the V5 I think could it be requested from Swansea? Might make the difference between a sale or not if it could avoid an IVA test?
Darkspeed
15-12-2022, 15:18
and was known as the "insurance job" - LOL
So we have a Evoluzione a GTO and mine the WTF. Thinking about that I may have to Ask CJ if he can do a WTF version of the HF logo for the door as well as the Strazio's for the door top ;)
Darkspeed
15-12-2022, 15:32
The Corse EVO Chassis-
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Air jacks ! - What was this car being built for?
It was being built for GT Racing.
The Privilege Insurance GT series I think.
As a successor to the GTO car being discussed here.
As it was told to me the powers that be would not accept it as the series was based on production GT's and I don't think the McLaren F1 owners relished the idea of being beaten by a budget car built in a shed. Or cowshed to be more accurate.
Was this car ever road registered? If Lionel has the V5 I think could it be requested from Swansea? Might make the difference between a sale or not if it could avoid an IVA test?
As it was told to me yes it was registered although probably incorrectly.
I approached Lionel about the V5 some years ago and he said he still had it but wasn't willing to go further.
And that approach was solely for his own good, not mine.
tomsredstratos
15-12-2022, 20:12
John,
I take it this is the Graham Scott car having its prang in 2003.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NQzQVSjDarA
ProtoTipo
15-12-2022, 20:33
The car is here at 4:30
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIimsk87pQY)and here at 6:45 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P0NRiUnEy4o)
Strat Fan
15-12-2022, 21:51
It was being built for GT Racing.
As it was told to me the powers that be would not accept it as the series was based on production GT's and I don't think the McLaren F1 owners relished the idea of being beaten by a budget car built in a shed.
Throughout the late '90's GT racing started to become overrun with bespoke race cars such as the Merc CLK GTR, Porsche GT1, Toyota GT1, Nissan R390 etc etc, rather than true GT cars - such as the Mclaren F1, Porsche 911, Lotus Esprit GT1, Marcos etc which were built as road cars first and then converted to race.
To homologate these cars for racing the manufacturers had to prove they had built a road going version to make the race car eligible to go racing.
Something akin to the Stratos & 037 with rallying but there the numbers were higher.
By the time the EVO was (maybe) ready to go racing the rules were likely clamping down on the "specials" and with no road car version to homologate it the EVO would have become ineligible to take part in such events.
With the right engine it could have been competitive at some level but with the engine configuration used and lack of development/budget available then reliability was always going to be a challenge.
John,
I take it this is the Graham Scott car having its prang in 2003.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NQzQVSjDarA
Yes indeed.
Darkspeed
18-12-2022, 00:39
Well that did not hang about long !
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Guy Mayers
18-12-2022, 11:00
Anyone on here?
Not guilty.
Apparently two is enough.....
Darkspeed
18-12-2022, 14:11
I wish someone had given me that advice with Ginetta's ... or projects in general
Guy Mayers
15-02-2023, 16:24
Looks like the buyer was Auto Integrale in Reading. Shell stripped off the chassis, chassis looks like it's been repaired/repainted but the project is now back on the market. No price noted on the Facebook post.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/947697435255200/user/100063529542249
Guy
NoCorseChris
16-02-2023, 10:00
Good spot Guy.
The vendor has an…….optimistic interpretation of “90% complete” I feel!
Strat Fan
16-02-2023, 12:34
?25k Mentioned in the comments, not a bad mark up from the ?15k or so it was advertised at before.
Guy Mayers
16-02-2023, 12:46
That's a good markup. Or not if they've spent ?10k in parts/labour/sub contract to strip it and paint the chassis. Suspect they might be cutting their losses but either way, it's a potential route into ownership for someone wanting a car and unable to wait?
Guy
ProtoTipo
16-02-2023, 12:57
Has it got a V5?
I can't see the advert/photos, because I don't do Facebook.
I don't want to buy it....
hollytree
16-02-2023, 13:11
Good spot Guy.
The vendor has an??.optimistic interpretation of ?90% complete? I feel!
I have a massive biscuit tin of loose Lego bricks. Anything I want to make in Lego is about 90% complete!!
I got to know Keith (owner of Auto Integrale) very well over the 7/8 years I owned my EVO 2. He's an absolute Gent. As well as a business man, obvs :-)
Cheers,
Hedge
Guy Mayers
16-02-2023, 18:03
I know someone else who travels there for services on his Evo2. Heard nothing but good stuff about them.
Guy
Keith rebuilt the 2 litre twin cam I have to go in the Allora. It looks the Bees Knees.
I messaged him a few times about the Corse. He actually bought it off Graham Scott who still owned it despite the advert being a bit misleading about where it was and who was selling it. Is it advertised with engine/ box etc?
Guy Mayers
16-02-2023, 19:03
Keith rebuilt the 2 litre twin cam I have to go in the Allora. It looks the Bees Knees.
I messaged him a few times about the Corse. He actually bought it off Graham Scott who still owned it despite the advert being a bit misleading about where it was and who was selling it. Is it advertised with engine/ box etc?
The engine and box are shown in the photographs, I also suspect that it couldn't be described as 90% complete without them!
Guy
I suspect, Guy, that the 90% refers to parts in the package rather than man hours to completion! For some reason I can't see the advert.
Guy Mayers
16-02-2023, 19:45
Search for Auto Integrale on Facebook?
Indeed. I can see it now.
Not sure on the photo captioned " as originally built". Unless they did run the car on UDN' s plate at some time.
But they were two different cars.
ProtoTipo
17-02-2023, 08:18
I see it now. Thanks Guy.
Guy Mayers
19-03-2023, 21:49
Now sold per Auto Integrale's Facebook page. Anyone on here?
Guy
Guy Mayers
23-03-2023, 20:08
Sadly Keith says the buyer had to pull out so it's still available, someone needs to save this car.
Darkspeed
23-03-2023, 22:22
And also dropped to 18K - one price suits all it seems.
Ha, yes Andrew.
A choice of projects available at the moment. When did that last happen? Contents a bit different though.
Still a lot of work in the Scott car but you would be getting something a bit different.
Guy Mayers
24-05-2023, 20:21
Still available, on eBay with a reserve price but starting at ?1000.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/354806035864?fbclid=IwAR39B91Pz1Fo1t1aBgzKalDLL-CsYZYDnmZb-CmikRcc5-MLJY9wM6XK3_M
No connection to the seller.
Guy
Darkspeed
25-05-2023, 08:50
I suggest it finishes at 8,900 with reserve not met - at a guess reserve set at 16,500.
ProtoTipo
25-05-2023, 10:53
Is the rear spoiler deliberately fitted at that angle for a reason?
Strat Fan
25-05-2023, 11:16
Is the rear spoiler deliberately fitted at that angle for a reason?
Yes, because it ran with the big full wing mounted above it.
Darkspeed
25-05-2023, 13:14
Good spot Guy.
The vendor has an??.optimistic interpretation of ?90% complete? I feel!
Chassis blast and paint/powder coat increases the completeness to 95% by all accounts .......
A quick look and tally up and I am somewhere between negative 50% and 60% percent completed - and about 50% of the parts needed ! - but what do I know ;)
Guy Mayers
25-05-2023, 13:47
The eBay listing says it's missing front shocks and the screen and radiator? I assume none of them are an issue except maybe the screen? Or does an LB one fit?
The biggie nobody has asked about is registration? I seem to recall it running around on a V plate back in the day (says he off to look at old copies of Auto Italia) but was it ever put through SVA/IVA and what does it say on the logbook? I suspect that might have more of an impact on value now than a few missing parts?
Assuming it's build date is pre SVA (provable by magazine entries) can it still be granted IVA exemption?
Guy
ProtoTipo
25-05-2023, 14:45
Assuming it's build date is pre SVA (provable by magazine entries) can it still be granted IVA exemption?
Guy
From what John D. says Guy, it'll need to go through IVA.
If that's the case, the other Corse on eBay looks to be a blanker canvas?
Yes, because it ran with the big full wing mounted above it.
Thanks Craig, I should have looked at the photo at the beginning of this thread. 'Makes sense now.
Darkspeed
25-05-2023, 16:14
The logbook is for a 3.0L Lancia Beta ! ( from a sellers post on FB) To be correctly registered it would need BIVA. Not sure if the logbook could be used for a age related ! ( sketchy)
Guy Mayers
25-05-2023, 16:25
I doubt it could get an age related plate now... If DVLA asked for evidence of the 3.0 in a Beta I think that would need some creative photoshopping. Or finding a Pic of the rear engined Busso powered Lancia Beta that Mick Covill built and photoshop that number plate. Suspect this one will end up as either a trackday toy or go through an IVA test with a Q plate being issued. Unless you have an Alfa 164 donor car you could swap the engine number onto? It's a tangled web we (try to) weave.
Guy
I suspect we are actually inadvertently hitting on the reason why this is not moving. There is now supposedly a V5 with the car, but I remain unconvinced its actually for this car in its earliest form.
But who knows? What I was told about its early history could well be doubtful as the early posts in this thread refer to.
Things have changed over the years and it's not as easy to satisfy DVLA, DVSA or VOSA, or whatever they are called this week.
Darkspeed
25-05-2023, 23:41
Personally, I think the reason it's not moving is that its just very overpriced for what you are getting and most of what you get would be binned.
Even mine looked "wonderful" when getting magazine attention.
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But after a couple of decades very little was actually useful.
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I doubt if much more than 5% of the original number of parts remain. Many rivets were lost in the battle and did not make it back ;)
ProtoTipo
26-05-2023, 07:28
Is a "Linton Corse" similar to a Litton Corse?
Strat Fan
26-05-2023, 07:42
Is a "Linton Corse" similar to a Litton Corse?
The two places are very close so they do get confused quite often.
Linton is may be slightly more up market so it maybe helps raise the value!
Guy Mayers
27-05-2023, 15:37
Auction ended early. Looks like it has got a new owner at last. Looking forward to updates on rebuild progress and seeing it out and about again!
Guy
Darkspeed
27-05-2023, 21:56
Auction ended early. Looks like it has got a new owner at last. Looking forward to updates on rebuild progress and seeing it out and about again!
Guy
Interestingly (maybe) it says not for sale now - rather than sold.
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