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Thread: Real or Replica?

  1. #1

    Real or Replica?

    It’s one of the first questions people ask you, “Is it a real one?”.
    If you’re not a specialist it’s hard to tell with a replica, whether it is a GT40, a Cobra, ‘C’ type Jaguar, Ferrari, Lamborghini or any of the other replica/look-alikes available.
    With no tax disc required nowadays it is even harder to tell that the flash Ferrari you are looking at is actually a Toyota under the skin, with fake panels, engine cover and wide wheels.
    Of course the Stratos was a kit car built by Lancia to go rallying using many parts from the Fiat empire:
    1 Ferrari Dino engine, wheel hubs, Daytona rear number plate light, dashboard air vents
    2 Fiat X1/9 headlights, door handles and catches, body catches, modified radiator and fans
    3 Lancia Fulvia side indicator lights
    4 Fiat 850 Rear lights, interior door handles
    5 Fiat 124 various instruments, steering column stalks, lights, interior mirror.
    6 Lancia Beta bootlid knob, gear knob, door mirror
    So how do you tell a replica Stratos from the real thing? A replica can be bought for £10-30K, an original 10 – 20 times that. You need a check list to tell the Difference.
    1 Is it Left hand Drive? All Stratos were, there have been RHD conversions, but RHD usually means a replica. Of course there are many LHD replicas too.
    2 Stick a magnet on the roof. Front, rear and doors of the Stratos are glassfibre, cockpit in steel. Most replicas are all fibreglass, although some steel (Gartrac?) copies have been made and steel cockpits have been re-manufactured.
    3 The engine is the Ferrari Dino 2.4 V6. Maglioli is reputed to have also fitted the 308 V8 engine, visually identical and certainly a straightforward swap.
    4 Wheels are Ferrari 5 stud 104 mm PCD. 4 stud means replica.
    5 Original Stratos came in choice of 5 colours, but of course many re-sprays and liveries abound. Competition regulations require the removal or covering of racing numbers on finishing or retiring from an event. Old Rally plates belong on the garage wall, not the car!
    6 If you are looking for an original car, it does come down to provenance, checking of chassis numbers etc. Factory cars re-used chassis numbers after re-shells and less reputable sellers can falsify things as well, due to the sums of money involved.

    So which replica is closest to the original?
    Most would say the Hawk/Transformer.
    Litton/Corse models (no longer available) have been built to a very high standard and certainly pass muster as replicas, but chassis changes (improvements?) make them easy to tell from the real thing. Body shape is harder to achieve the correct finish.
    Similarly the Lister Bell departs from the original design in many ways, from the shape of the body to the layout and use of components.

    After 40 years of course it is easy to improve on the original design of the Stratos.
    Everyone to their own of course, but if it has power steering, air conditioning, radio, electric door locks, bicycle door mirrors, LED lights, it’s not a Stratos….

    Ready for corrections, disagreements, abuse…

    Struan


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  2. #2
    SEC Member Strat Fan's Avatar
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    Re: Real or Replica?

    Quite simply if its made in England, has a space frame chassis & a grp centre tub then it is not a Strato's
    Last edited by Strat Fan; 15-02-2015 at 21:54.
    "You can lead a horse to water, but a pencil must be lead"
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    Free user Cadami's Avatar
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    Re: Real or Replica?

    Tends to be the intro question I'm asked Struan.... My fav reply is "What do you think"? Breaks the ice............
    Closest to the original?
    I chose a Hawk for historic reasons. Not a simple build but damn worth the challenge. Vince's recreation is pretty cool :-)
    LB is a simpler / modern kit car approach. Takes the hassle out of the build........
    Last edited by Cadami; 15-02-2015 at 22:09.

  4. #4
    SEC Member LM mic's Avatar
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    Re: Real or Replica?

    Closest to the original ??????????????????????????
    I remember this subject had been debated in another thread ???????????????????????????????
    Is it really necessary to redo all this UNnecessary debate ? as none of any KIT can be compared to the real ????????????????????????????
    Last edited by LM mic; 15-02-2015 at 22:26.

  5. #5
    SEC Member Strat Fan's Avatar
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    Re: Real or Replica?

    Quote Originally Posted by LM mic View Post
    Closest to the original ??????????????????????????
    I remember this subject had been debated in another thread ???????????????????????????????
    Is it really necessary to redo all this UNnecessary debate ? as none of any KIT can be compared to the real ????????????????????????????
    The forum needs some spice, some activity, some conversation, what it doesn't need is a "mines better than your's" debacle like on the old forum.

    There are choices in kit supplier, that is not a bad thing. Each individual chooses according to their own personal requirements. historically the Hawk won out over the Corse because the majority preferred that it looked similar to an original Strato's under the skin as well as above it.
    Vince's Hawk is exceptional, that is beyond dispute, it is an example to not only those who are building a Strato's replica but to anyone who wishes to build a kit car of what can be achieved with a generous dose of thought, time & ability. It is possibly the closest that anyone has come to replicating an original car, LHD could have sealed the deal as would have the Dino engine but I suspect that would have rendered it less usable.
    There are other very nice examples under construction too, Ducatiman, Chris C, John H, Graham H etc, I believe Dave H's replica car is very good too.

    Any prospective customer should assess all available products in the flesh & speak to the manufacturers directly, this will in turn allow them to make an informed decision as to what suits their personal requirements.
    "You can lead a horse to water, but a pencil must be lead"
    Stan Laurel

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    Re: Real or Replica?

    This thread appeals and I think, for me, it is about recreating a fantasy in a kind of personal, usable way. I had a picture of a Stratos on my wall when I was 15 and the idea of being able to replicate that - and possibly even refine it - without departing too much from the original concept is very attractive. We all invest a great deal of time, energy and thought into that process which, in itself, is very satisfying. And in practical terms maybe ultimately more enjoyable as a 'real world car', the sort that one doesn't have to worry about in quite the same way as being saddled with the custodianship (that is a word...!) of an irreplaceable original. In fact, my Stratos (Hawk) will be my everyday-ish transport and it will hopefully work properly and I plan to appreciate it in the mundane world of the M40 traffic jams and station car parks in a way that I could never enjoy a real Stratos, 246 or other genuine Dino that undeniably shares its lineage - I'd be worried sick!


    Quote Originally Posted by Strat Fan View Post
    The forum needs some spice, some activity, some conversation, what it doesn't need is a "mines better than your's" debacle like on the old forum.

    There are choices in kit supplier, that is not a bad thing. Each individual chooses according to their own personal requirements. historically the Hawk won out over the Corse because the majority preferred that it looked similar to an original Strato's under the skin as well as above it.
    Vince's Hawk is exceptional, that is beyond dispute, it is an example to not only those who are building a Strato's replica but to anyone who wishes to build a kit car of what can be achieved with a generous dose of thought, time & ability. It is possibly the closest that anyone has come to replicating an original car, LHD could have sealed the deal as would have the Dino engine but I suspect that would have rendered it less usable.
    There are other very nice examples under construction too, Ducatiman, Chris C, John H, Graham H etc, I believe Dave H's replica car is very good too.

    Any prospective customer should assess all available products in the flesh & speak to the manufacturers directly, this will in turn allow them to make an informed decision as to what suits their personal requirements.

  7. #7
    SEC Member ducatiman's Avatar
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    Re: Real or Replica?

    Not this again.....................

    The selection of manufacturer is the choice of the builder and his reasons for that selection should be respected, what is more interesting is watching the development and progress of each individual build as no two replica's are the same. If someone wants to select and install the latest available V6 engine with air conditioning so what, and if an individual wants to get that original switch and tacho for his dash, good for him..................We all have a reason why we want to build a Stratos replica and most of the time is that we love the look of the car. Look at it, for a design that is over 40 years old it is outstanding....................

    All our replica's are also built within the constraints of an individuals skills, available time and the biggest factor will always be the budget to complete the project...............

    So lets just congratulate an individual who builds his replica and gets it on the road, the joy that it will bring to him and others around...............
    Hawk HF3000 - Engine: Alfa GTV 3.0L 24v V6, Dry Sump - Gearbox: Sadev 6 Speed Sequential ST90-14 - Suspension: Nitron 3 Way Adjustable - Wheels: Hawk Compomotive - Tyres: Pirelli P7 Corsa

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    Re: Real or Replica?

    I've been on here just about a year. I've also looked through a ton of build threads and have an LB on order. In all honesty, aside from the motor, steering wheel and chassis, I have a hard time telling the difference from a lot of the cars. Of course I can tell the difference between steel and fiberglass, but from a visual standpoint it isn't easy to tell the difference.

  9. #9
    SEC Member LM mic's Avatar
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    Re: Real or Replica?

    OK
    Apologise with my post ; may be I wrote that because on the other one stating about "which kit is more close to the real "
    http://www.stratosec.com/Forum/showt...ar-of-30-years
    I understood the discuss started to "deviate" to some "hard " debate ???? ( If I remember ?????)

    Otherwise my English language not being enought skilled for this sort of thread I will only read other members opinions !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! LOL
    Last edited by LM mic; 16-02-2015 at 09:01.

  10. #10
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    Re: Real or Replica?

    God! Not more electioneering.....
    "There now follows (another) party political broadcast on behalf of the Hawk owners party".
    Anyway there was me thinking the forum had gone a bit quiet and tame. Still absolutely invaluable of course!
    And then along comes Struan with a carefully constructed contribution to stimulate things again. Well done that man.

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